January 23, 2008

Guy vs. Girl on Guys and Girls

Last night I was at work with a male co-worker. We started talking about guys and girls and how they are different and similar, and it got pretty interesting so I figured I would share what I learned with the class and see if you all agree, disagree, have other opinions or things to add, etc.

It started out with him talking about how he objectifies women. He rationalized it by saying "Well woman dress up to show off their bodies, so they must want to be objectified!" And I said, "That's not true. We dress up to look good so we have confidence in ourselves, not to be objectified by men. " Then he asked me if I ever wear heels, to which I responded yes, occasionally. He said "That's a perfect example, they hurt your feet, but you wear them so your legs will look good so others notice you." Again, I told him that's not true. I wear heels because they add to the outfit, not to have my legs objectified. Although I don't mind attracting attention from the opposite sex, my goal in dressing cute is not to be objectified. If it gets me noticed that's one thing, if it gets catcalls, that's not what I'm going for.

The next part of the conversation went on to how men and women approach one and other. He told me that guys are extremely intimidated by good looking girls and have a hard time approaching them. I told him the same is true about girls with guys. Then he went on to say that if a girl is not as good looking, they are much more approachable, although also not as desirable. Finally, he said that the only real success he's ever had in relationships with females have all been initiated by the female with outright flirting. He claims that guys never pick up on subtle hints and if you want something you have to put yourself out there.

I responded to this with "Yes, but if I walked up to a guy and said 'hey, you're hot, I wanna be on you.' there are two negative things that could come of that interaction. It may work out nicely and they'll be flattered and hang out with me, or I may get completely outright rejected, which hurts the self-confidence a little bit, or the guy will think I'm a hoochie who walks up to guys and says I wanna be on you on a regular basis. Not to mention the fact that doing that takes some major cajones, which I don't necessarily have! Therefore, I don't usually approach guys, or if I do I say something along the lines of "Hey, I'm Kiki, what's your name?" and start up a conversation.

I also told him that I feel the same way about guys approaching me. If a guy makes a sexual advance towards me without initiating any kind of conversation or showing any vested interest in me first, I'm not going to respond well. I will assume this guy does this to lots of girls and I'm just another random one he happened to notice.

So for the guys and girls out there, how do you feel about approaching others and being approached? Is there a technique you use that works well or things that you refuse to do? Do you agree or disagree with the opinions in this blog post? Let's hear it!

8 comments:

Sarah R said...

On the topic of females being objectified:

This is a very interesting topic to me because I spend the majority of my time around men. This is for several reasons, first my peers in class are for the most part men. Oddly enough I rarely talk to the few females that are in class with me. I've learned over time that for me men are easier to get along with in a classroom or friendship setting and so I tend to gravitate towards them. Secondly, my female friends get married or move away and for some reason women tend to leave friends behind when they've found a serious partner. But I digress...

It has been a very long time since I've been single and so I have no idea how I would react to someone I wanted to date. However, I do know that when I dress up in heels and a cute outfit I'm generally more worried about how the other women around me perceive my appearance. I've been this way since a young girl. It probably stems from the days of middle school when girls could be very mean (especially when you were going through those awkward phases.) If I wear a cute outfit and my boyfriend hates it I usually refuse to change because I like it and I know other women who see me will understand my fashion choices. I don't understand why I care what other women think. If men like it well great but I'm definitely not dressing for them. I'm dressing that way for the sake of fashion (as uncomfortable, painful or ridiculous as it may be) and my own self esteem. Then again I've fielded my share of inappropriate and/or unwanted comments and advances from men while I was wearing a t-shirt and sneakers.

nicko said...

In a way I think it's true that women dress to please men...I mean come on why else would you go out to a party in a shirt that shows off your breasts...because that's what men want to see. Does it work? Well usually yes so then you continue to wear it along with your friends. When you wear a revealing outfit like that you want to be objectified.

On the other hand there are girls out there who can look just as good if not better in jeans and a sweatshirt.

What attracts the man may depend on what that man is looking for. A one night stand or a long term relationship. For a one night stand he will go for the girl with the shirt showing the most skin because if she's already showing that much skin why not show the rest? He may feel sorry for the girl when they wake up she thinks they're going to hang out again however he won't think about it too much because she was throwing herself out there and got his attention by showing that skin. If she was looking for a longer relationship she should have went for the nice modest shirt.

The girl in the sweatshirt shows the girl is comfortable with herself in whatever she wears where ever she goes. She doesn't need tight fitting clothes to catch a guys attention because she has a great personality that will get the guy whose looking for a relationship.

I once read in a book that we need to be comfortable with our elf and have a relationship with ourself before we get into one with another person.

I'm not saying a girl can't dress cute...I understand looking good for yourself. It just seems like a lot of girls worry too much about how they look and what they're wearing. I enjoy getting cleaned up and putting on a nice outfit. It makes me feel good because I look good and feel confident.

nicko said...

by the way it does seem to be easier to talk to someone who isn't drop dead gorgeous. It's less nerve racking and it helps you build confidence to talk to someone more attractive.

Princess said...

In my opinion, guys do objectify women most of the time. Just look at the media and ads all over the malls. "Sex" sells.

Another thing...I believe it is the man's duty to pursue the girl. Call me traditional, but a girl who throws themself on a guy just seems too forward...too much!

So the question is, what can we do to change the standard that women are held to in our society, and how can we counteract the objectification of women????

Meghan Francis said...

Of course every individual looks at the opposite sex differently. There are of course stereotypes that many people subscribe to. Kiki provides probably some of the best examples when looking at how we tend to generalize each other purely by gender, and what we believe gender looks like i.e. femininity and masculinity.

First of all Kiki claims that the guy she is talking to objectifies women. With that comment alone Kiki is opening a Pandora’s Box of general gender issues that stand between men and women.

But on a certain level don’t all women expect to be objectified somewhat by men? Kiki needs to realize that yes, women do dress up in order to feel more confident about themselves, but how do we gain confidence, by receiving attention! And doesn’t the biggest boost of confidence come from having a guy tell you that you look beautiful, or that you have great legs? Dressing a particular way does have its advantages and disadvantages. While some women may not appreciated being whistled at or honked at, some women thrive on it. Some women want to blend in while others want to be admired.

The next part of the conversation with how men and women approach potential romantic relationships reminded me so much of high school I thought she was talking to half the boys I went to school with. I guess to answer Kiki’s question at the end is that I personally take the laid back approach. If I see a guy I think is cute I’ll talk to him, based on that conversation I’ll decide if I want to pursue a relationship. I’ve never been one to have one night stands (though I’ve had my share) but of course there is an entirely different approach to that, much like the male’s approach in this example.

I think what is most important to keep in mind is that technically speaking everyone has an opinion related to the opposite sex that is true, but what’s most important to keep in mind is that we cannot generalize what it means to be female or male, what it means to be attracted to one another, what it means to be in a relationship. So many of these characteristics are not based upon gender, but rather individual morals and values. This conversation between these two people is so superficial and so generic that I think we’ve all heard it before. To even have this conversation is demoralizing what this class is about. To bring up the subject of “sex sells” or the objectification and impossible standards for women’s beauty that society has grown into is a subject that I would rather not discuss, especially since these standards and norms have been part of our society for so long that I personally think it’s about time that we got over that hill and start working on our self confidence. If more women had confidence, then they wouldn’t worry about society’s standards. So maybe the better question is: why are women so afraid to be themselves?

sixxam said...

Interesting points, everyone. I'll add mine.
You may call me traditional as well, but I very rarely will approach a guy and strike up conversation. I don't know if it's due to my lack of self-confidence or because good looking guys intimidate me, or because.....let's face it, rejection sucks. So, I agree with princess. I think it's the man's job to approach the woman, however after reading all the other posts, I think that men are in the same position as women and may be just as reluctant to approach the opposite sex which makes me abandon my traditional views. Very interesting post kiki. Thanks!

AnnonymousCommBlogger380 said...

I will agree to a point that some women do dress up only to attract attention. However the same is also true of some men. Many members of both sexes dress nicely to feel good about themselves, they are not just trying to objectify themselves.

As for approaching the other sex. I have always been shy and have difficulties starting a conversation. If someone starts asking me questions I will usually respond and after a little bit I am fairly open and easy to talk to. It is not that I don't want to talk to someone, it is usally that it takes a lot for me to just go up to someone and start a conversation. It seems easier for me to get to know someone and start talking to them in a class setting than to start with some random person at the bar or mall. I know that there are a lot of people that have the same thoughts on approaching others for the first time. So for those that are more confident with their own social skills I would say that you should go ahead and approach someone if you would like to meet them.

ThursNiteSoundtrack said...

I certainly think the only reason to dress “cute” is to catch the eye of the opposite sex. While I agree that feeling pretty makes you feel better about yourself as a person… I think that the approval you give yourself stems from the fact that you know others will find you attractive as well. I certainly don’t think women wear shirts that compliment their chests because they want to just mix in with the crowd. Subconsciously if not consciously, the individual is dressing themselves to gain the attention from other individuals they are interested in.